Božji Gej = Divine Gay. Krzysztof Charamsa
David Magazine: Revija za moške s stilom (Slovenia)
n. 34 / 2017, ss. 94-97
Divine Gay. Krzysztof Charamsa
How did your life first cross with Catholic Church and when?
I have crossed with the Church as a part of my identity, which I have received from my family.
I remind myself to a time when I was a child and Church and Jesus ideas were saint for me. Was the same with you when you were young?
Yes, I was sure that Christianity is the right way to respect and love every person without discrimination.
How was created idea that you become a priest? When did you hear so famous “Call of God”?
It was a sense of certitude that being a priest was my place in the world.
You latest book FIRST STONE which is translated also to Slovenian language by Mladinska Knjiga PRVI KAMEN speak about your personal life inside the Church organization?
This is a story of discovering of another face of the Church organization, where God and religion is not a spiritual way to be happy, but a political and a social way to dominate persons, discriminating women and LGBTIQ persons.
I assume it was very hard to be present on Congregation meetings especially with topics over celibate?
No, I didn’t have any problem with celibacy. I explain it in my book. I begin my love relationship when I understand that celibacy has nothing to do with Christian faith. The celibacy is the prohibition for heterosexual men to be married. It was introduced for developing the financial, political and social power of the clergy. It is unhuman, but it is not my problem. I’m gay and I don’t want to marry a woman. For me personally what it was hard in the Congregation was to live a paranoical obsession against gays.
In Slovenian Church we have person who was president of church court and dismissed because of sexual affair but he is still lecturing on Catholic University and Law University where he has direct contact with young people. How do you see this situation and how is possible that Church leave this kind of situation? Is there no etic and moral inside of Church? Is really just fight for positions and power?
If you want eliminate paedophilia and sexual violence in the Church you must reform its patriarchal and puritanical sexual doctrine. The Church doesn’t want to do it, so it continues to hide sexual criminals, who cannot develop their sexuality in freedom and without complex and internal repression. This is one of the reasons of violence and abuses.
When did you know that the feeling inside of you to love a men is so strong that you are able to admit that in such a conservative organisation as Chatolic Church is?
It was a long process of coming out, when, first of all, I matured the love of myself and my sexual orientation.
As you admit that you are gay inside the Church you were impeached right away? But how did you change personally? You are still priest? Although you love a man?
I’m a priest for the whole of my life, in a love relationship with my partner. In the future it will be not strange to have priests married in accordance to their sexual orientation. So Eduard and me are as a “prophecy” of the future.
How did your beloved men reacted during the whole situation? Did you both have power to go threw all situations from your love and strong relation?
You should ask Eduard about it. For me his love has been the power to be faithful to myself, my identity and dignity as a gay man, which was destroyed by the Church.
Jesus believe we all deserve to be loved and to respect others. Why would gay person be so wrong for Catholic Church?
Homophobia is a part of sexist and heteronormative power of the Church. You need a minority enemy (Jews or gay) to be hated and stigmatised in order to dominate majority. There are no religious reasons to discriminate gays.
Is it not strange that organization like Church is talking about values and then on the other hand they eat down all values in terms of power, money and life behind the walls of Church organization?
If it is, this is the corruption of the essential idea of religion. I think that many confessions and religions follow this temptation. In this way God is not a spiritual issue, but a political, financial and social way of power. The true religion is another thing.
Why do you think Church need to be so rich as it is today as Jesus said that Church is build by Peter on the rock not in exclusive palaces and Jesus was walking without shoes not driving with exclusive cars as bishops and Church economist do?
When Church has not spiritual power, it needs money to keep on existing.
In our country Church is the only organization which don´t pay the taxes? Why is this alloud? I mean if we all pay why people can pay On Sunday ceremonial money without taxes to Church and laso for other things such as funeral and similar? Is it not this hypocritic also from the Church rulers?
With any doubt, there is an abuse of taxes privileges for the Church in many countries. This is also a problem of power and we must reflect about responsibility of States and societies who permit these abuses.
How do you see big affair of Vatican bank where mafia money laundring was discovered but now all is quite and just go on and on as it never happened? Is there none inside the Church who wants to have clear picture on this kind of situations?
The mentality in the Church is the following: the end justifies any means. It is quite difficult to find persons in the clergy who really want to change something.
In Slovenia Church was one of the biggest investors and they almost went bankrupt as they invest in investment banks nearly 2 mrd and all was lost also ordinary peoples money which they invested trusting Church. Is this really Church or is it just excuse how to steel money from very low people, similar as when Mr Luther saw seek people in Rome buying redundancies? I mean Slovenian Church in fact invested also in Television which owned also porn programmes?
You mean: the Church has obsession against pornography and promote it. Yes, in the clergy the obsession of money is the way to supply their complex of sexuality and the lack of a healthy sexual relationship. What happens in Vatican also happens in Slovenia or Poland.
Today young generation live in a very hectic world full of wrong ideas impressions out of the real relationships and true friendships. It seems like all what matters is just image and how many clicks you have on facebook or instagram. But what about modern values? Who educate young generation? Which values do they follow? Why none tells them the truth?
I think we must discover the conditions of real love and friendship. Catholic propaganda doesn’t help it. Human love needs gender-equality of persons, neglected by Church. This is “the first stone” of happiness.
I believe in pure love and I think if Church is mixing in it or evan worse that Church dignitaries exploit this is the worst thing that can happen in this world. You agree?
Yes, I agree. I believe in fair love that is respectful of persons. Love is not a propriety of Church, religion or State. State and Church must – everyone in its space – only recognize, protect and promote human love. The egalitarian marriage is a human and Christian right of every person: gay, straight or trans.
Dejan David Kemperl
Editor in Chief